Archive for July, 2009

Look what i have found in my back garden.

Hi guys,my first thread.old saying my back garden,these items i came across in a reclamation centre 2 miles from
my home hope you enjoy.one item the t34 i was informed
is in working order,hope the pics come out ok.
Steve.

Who dares wins.

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Lot of medals for sale

Hi guys,

Sorry for the BAD pictures.

The seller wants 1800 Euros.

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Volunteer shield

Hi guys,been wondering what else to collect. So i thought volunteer shields may be good,as i like them. Here's my first. Stewy S

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Zelinsky-Kummant gas masks and ww1 technologies

The antigas protection developed in 1915-1916 was researched step by step, but the chemical weapon was explored much faster, than defense. Protection of "damp masks» has been based on chemical linkage of poisoned chemical agents . And it could be strengthened, increasing quantity of layers inside the filter, and to change them, replacing filler. And even to make an universal changing elements for the filtering system
But as poisoning chemical agents already in 1915 used tens chemical compounds, and potential quantity of poisoning agents suitable for use in the battle was estimated in hundreds.

Change of a principe functioning of gasmask was required. And a new principle has been found very quickly as it was known for a long time for a nonspecific linkage of molecules of the chemical agents based on absorbent agents. Researchers had a huge choice such a agents — oxid aluminium, charcoal, natrium lime, etc. And at last it's necessary step to choose from them which one has greatest absorbing ability. German scientists have preferred kieselgur with pumice. In Russia the first absorbing filling in a filter was a natrium lime ( a mix of slack lime with caustic natrium). The gas mask on such basis has become history of Russian individual defence with name of “Gasmask of Mines institute”
The occurrence of the first Russian gas masks are in details investigated by Figurovsky (in 1942, and 1956). The gas mask of the "College of Mines" is developed in the summer of 1915 in the College of mines (St.-Petersburg) by prof A.A.Trusevich. In a basis the designs of gas masks earlier used in mine-rescue. The filter of a gas mask was attached to mask with a mouthpiece, i.e. Especially arranged rubber mouthpiece with the ledges coming for lips and supplied with piece for teeth
July, 8, 1915 the gas mask was be on the way to test, the director of the College of mines the well known physicist-chemist professor I. F.Schröder (1858-1918) was the chef of the commission
The commission had been ascertained considerable power of this filter in relation to chlorine. In September the new sample of this gas mask has been definitively designed.
September, 28th it became known that the large order of such gas masks for army is supposed. The same time was known about the new sample of the gas mask filter which had absorbing weight changed in comparison with the first sample
Besides natrium lime, filter exists also the coal offered as a sorbent for active chemicals by professor N. D.Zelinsky ( he offer to use it in June, 1915).
However as inventors of a "gas mask of Mines college" steal idea belonged to others (Zelinski) they did not know one subtlety — Zelinsky offered not simply coal, but the charcoal, which way of manufacturing process they did not know. Up to spring of 1916 inventors of the College of mines added to natrium lime a usual coal.
Though results of the tests made by the Moscow specialists, specified full un-adequacy of a "gas mask of the College of mines" and need of major changes in construction, its further destiny has turned oddly. After small alterations it has been accepted and ordered for production in number of 3,5 million exemplares.
The reader, has already guessed why: Correct , it was "pulled" someone's by «a strong hand». Persevering "inventors" from the College of mines had a great support of the prince Oldenburgsky
In April and May such gas masks has been sent to the front. One of batch of gas masks has been made under the name «Masks of the prince Oldenburgsky». In May the quantity of gas masks of the College of mines was made about 5 % of total ammount of gas masks of all types which was available, in July their relative quantity has increased to 15 %.
In the nearest futaure, as it should be happen- In July, 1916 during gas attack under Smorgon (on July, 19-20th) full disfunction of a gas mask of the College of mines was found out. Russian army had huge casualities, but only by September, 1916 after numerous protests this gas mask have withdrawn from army as unusable.
Figurovsky in his proceedings has found out in archive documents some advices to use of "dry filters» as from educational institutions, and from separate scientists.
However some of them new gasmasks were not bad at all than a gas mask of the College of mines, and in details have appeared considerably much better, these gas masks have not been accepted by Imperial Army. The reason of failure of these gas masks were the influential ability to a "sincered persones"


Zelinsky has create the report about his tests to Military Sanitary and Evaquation Department which's boss was Prinz Oldenburgsky, and... Has not received any answer.


Then in June, 1915 Zelinsky has reported to the "Anti gas commission at Russian technical society in Petrograd". The report have concerned as the ordinary and not a useful message. The chairman has inertly thanked Zelinsky, then Nikolay Dmitrievich Zelinsky on a straight line has addressed to the all-powerful prince, who «has put Zelinski back into the place», having recommended henceforth to address that reports only to his assistant.
On August, 12th Zelinsky has acted with the message about adsorbing capability of the activated charcoal at an extraordinary session of the Experimental commission of defence against gas poisonings. In the message Zelinsky specified that protective action of charcoal is universal and besides this coal is available in Russia in quite enough. This time his report became a great interest. The commission has decided to start immediately tests of antigas characteristics of charcoal.
In June, 1915 Zelinsky has got acquainted with the engineer from factory "Triangle" Mr. Kummant who has developed an original mask for a filter made by Zelinsky. Thanking their cooperation the invention has taken the finished form:filterfilled with the charcoal as a sorbent of steams of gas (Zelinsky) and a rubber mask to which this box fastened (Кумманта). Further the new gas mask was called as Zelinsky — Kummant gas mask


In January, 1916 management of the prince Oldenburgsky has ordered 3,5 million " gas masks of the College of mines" to the factory "Respirator", having taken away for this purpose the charcoal intended for Zelinsky. Personal interest of Prinz Oldenburgsky and "inventors", their vanity and fear to lose «material benefits» have moved the state. But after accident under Smorgon the star and Oldenburgsky's career was went. His department has been dismissed and all the gasmask business, was transferred to the Chemical committee at the Main Artillery Department.


On October, 5th, 1916 the special meeting about defense has decided to withdraw from front all masks, except Zelinsky — Kummant gasmasks. To the end of 1916 a part of Russian army have been supplied with these gas masks. Losses of Russian army from gas of has been sharply decreased


Zelinsky— Kummant gasmasks had either cylindrical, or a squared shape and the various sizes. In the top part of a box there was a pipe for fastening for the Kummant's mask. Instead of the bottom, box had a metal grid over which some layers of a gauze were located. From above over a coal layer also there was a gauze lining with cotton wool for protection of breathing against a coal dust.


The different factories made theyr own gas masks modifications. Therefore Russian army recieved three types of gas masks of Zelinsky — Kummant:
1) the Moscow sample has a rectangular filter with capacity 1000 cm3, but the sizes of charcoal grains a little bigger
2)the Petrograd sample this type was a first which was goes to the Army supply, had oval filter- inconvenient being use; capacity 700 cm3
3)Standard sample or, more precisely, the Goverment factory made was more similar to the oval Petrograd type and was a little bit shorter-height of 135 mm. The case had three ribs convex and two durabilities bent for reinforcement. The quality of this mask was better at two previous (fig. 44.2).


This mask was still far from perfect. Breath in a gas mask — "pendular", i.e. The inhale and an exhalation were made through the coal filter. This caused difficulty of breath. To avoid problems it was recommended to close from time to time the bottom of the filter by a hand and to make a strong exhalation. Thus air left between ears and at a following inhale under a mask.


The rubber Kummant's masks was a one of the general parts of described types of gas masks, met two samples. The first type was not ergonomical by it's shape, gave a small field of vision and had no "horn" for cleaning eyelets. In the second type of a mask these lacks have been partially eliminated (fig. 44.3).


Apparent lack of a Zelinsky — Kummant stimulated creativity of inventors. Many have offered own designs of a gas mask, however thus without departing from offered by Zelinsky filtering system on the basis of the activated coal. Others made serious improvements in gasmask
These improvements concerned valve systems to separate ways for a inhale and an breathe out and in certain cases to duration of filter action.Figurovsky in his book choose the better works of Rozenblat (assistant of Zelinsky), prince Avalova (the employee of anty gas laboratory in Petrograd; ) and the engineer Bogoroditsky.
In 1916 the casualities of the Russian Army at gas attacks was about 20 %, but by the winter after the effect of training has affected, losses have decreased to 2-3 %. In 1917 with the same gas mask of casualities did not exceed 1,5 %.


Zelinsky remained "the undesirable" inventor for the persons who are responsible for supply of Russian army by gas masks. That negative impression which he leave about himself in an office of the prince Oldenburgsky, has affected his material welfare. He has not received any money for the invention and continued to work in the labaratory which work for alcohol factories, where he served before he invented filter. After February revolution he was allowed to return to the Moscow university.
Blossoming of his scientific activity was in the years of the Soviet Union — from USSR he has received everything of what the scientist can dream only. Engineer Kummant was more pragmatic inventor, than Zelinsky, — he has patented the mask on his name and took from manufacturers by 50 copecks for each of made by them ( approx 5 USD today) . But who knows if this money was useful to Kummant after 1917 year.
During the First World War in Russia has been made 11 million 185 thousand 750 pieces of gas masks of Zelinsky — Kummant.

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German handgun

Hi,

Can one identify the date this gun was made? and what do the initials on the bottom and side mean? gun number is 177288

Thanks,

Neil.

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Question Pilotka Tankiste

Hello,

J am right not to like this marking?

Regards

Marc

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Museum: Roman archaeological museum - Aldenburgensis

Roman archaeological museum

Aldenburgensis






Exclusively for WRF members, a photographic report of my visit to the Roman archaeological museum in Aldenburgensis (Oudenburg).


Their website:

Stad Oudenburg - Romeins Archeologisch Museum

The Romans have always fascinated me. They were the first militaristic superpower to emerge. They controlled the then known world. Roman soldiers were yust like their German counterparts 1700 years later truly the iconic figures of their time. They also again like their German counterparts of WWII had the nicest uniforms and headgear of their time; Lorica segmentata. I have build up a small collection over the years of three Roman artifacts that I will show at the end of the presentation.

I visited the Roman archaeological museum in Oudenburg (Latin: Aldenburgensis) last week. They completely renewd the museum and I had high expectations. Sadly IMO they are trying to be 'cool', 'modern', 'high tech' and 'interactive'. This results in a lot of modern maps & prints, computers and plasma screens, all at the expense of the items displayed. The entry fee of 5 Euro p.p. is also to high IMO, we really looked at every item and still were out of the museum in less then 45 min.


Oudenburg:

Oudenburg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lorica segmentata:

Lorica segmentata - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Roman empire:

Roman Empire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia






Yours truly

Nick VR

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chromed M1916 Norway

Hi !

What do yo think ´bout this norwegian Krag-Jorgensen M 1916 bayonet ?

The bayo´s chromed an look´s a little "overworked", (wooden grip´s seems polished and the scabbard looks also overworked ... ?).

But I know, actually there´re Krag M 1894 chromed bayonet´s ...

All the stamps on this M 1916 are quite "deep" and it don´t seem´s, that the blueing was ground off roughly so I think, the bayo look´s legit anyway ... ?

Chromed bayonets for example were used as "Parade bayonet´s".

What´s your opinion ?


Cheers,

R.

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Local WW2 Airbase finds.

I decided to venture over to the local ww2 airbase last night (with a little encouragement from SteveT cool militaria )

The area is absolutely enormous, so I was just wondering around rather aimlessly!

For the first hour I didnt really find much, but on the way back to the car, a particular area was sending the old detector wild!! I didnt have much time due to bad light, so I could only dig for a short while.

I don't think Ive found anything of great significance - YET - but all the same, heres the bits I found yesterday.

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British Helmet ?

Here is another helmet I have,could anyone help with id.

Thanks z4.

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